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« My Radical Uncle | Main | Sucks, Doesn’t Suck »

March 08, 2005


Oh God. Now I will have to see this movie and I was SO planning NOT to!

Danny, you are so right when you say that of course Hitler was human. Such an important point to the complexity and confusion about life. It's this purist approach where "evil-doers" are thought of as alien that is so scary for me. Because surely we all contain some of these desperately human flaws? We all just cannot bear to face them within ourselves. And therefore ordinary people commit acts of horrendous terror and atrocity over and over again.

Most of the atrocities during the holocaust were carried out by ordinary people. And some, highly intellectual!

Yes, he was human, and that has always terrified me. The idea that someone is so charismatic that others carry out evil in his name sends chills. When I was a kid and we learned about him in school, I wondered if I was the only one dealing with the feelings of fear when I saw his face or heard his name. I don't think I could see the movie. As an adult I've tried to deal with my feelings about this and decided to visit the holocaust museum here. There was a section that the tour guide said and there were signs posted on the wall, that if you are sensitive don't look there. I looked. I experienced what I think was a panic attack. The movie might be too much for me.

It has been over a year since I saw "Downfall" at a local art theater. I still feel chills remembering stumbling out of the theater with a companion, and wondering how she could talk when all I wanted to do was hit my head against a wall and wail.

Humanize Hitler? This movie did more to set my mind against war and the despots who run it than any movie I have ever seen.

First of all, Magda Goebbels didn't kill her kids because they couldn't live without the National Socialism, it is a lie, but to be affraid of what the russians could have done to them, it is well known that the red army kill and rape millions of german women and children when they got into Germany, this was called the hidden Holocaust, besides, Roosevelt, Stalin and Churchil, were not so different of Hitler, everybody in that war was an assassin, search in the Internet about "Lebensborn children" in Norway, also I recommend you to read the book: "remember Dresden" so you will understand a little what really happened there and what the americans, Polish, French, british and russian did to us.

Who among us isn't quickly bored by those who can't own up to their country's past. Rudolf, just what exactly are you trying to "counter-balance" with Dresden? The war crimes in Poland/Ukraine/Russia? The Holocaust? Are you kidding? Hitler did not act alone. And 200 Dresdens wouldn’t justify, or even come close to comparing to, what the German nation did to its Jewish citizens and the citizens of neighboring nations. It appears to me that acceptance of historical responsibility is all that’s being asked of you. Be a man and study your own history honestly, it’s the least you can do.

Rudolf Rahn's comment is symptomatic for a german mainstream history-audit (I don't know the proper english word for what I wanted to say / Geschichtsrevisionist /).
In Germany it is so symptomatic that there is often been spoken about the evil russians that raped and killed, the evil tommys that bombed the wonderful (medieval) cities. They did this and they did that. But all in all, they are just trying to point out the cruel things "the others" did to them - to disfocus what "they" did.
But, I am not for establishing something like a historical scale. If you are really interested in WHAT history is, then you wouldn't put this and that in these scales. And you don't speak of "historical responsibility".

Let me say something to the movie.
In Germany this movie "made high waves", probably like in America. "Can you humanize Hitler?" "Are 'we' allowed to make a film with that issue?" - things like that. When I watched the movie, I thought it was a caricature. It pure pathos. At least for a german in his twenties. You have been confrontated with Hitler a lot; in school, books, films/documentations - such like from National Geographic. In Germany there is a mighty Historician called Guido Knopp - "like" the lead-historician for german history on television. He made hundreds of documentation films, that are not representating a scholastical approach on historical actions. A lot of people are watching his mass-media productions, so he is forming a "national identity", he gives the feeling that everyone can take part in a discussion when he watched one of his movies. That is wrong. The movie serves such desires. Unfortunately... for the good film-maker Bernd Eichinger.

Mr Rudolf Rahn: you maybe have forgot what the germans did in Russia and who started the war, and who wanted a BRUTAL war? Germany killed some 13 million innocent civilians in Russia..You mention Dresden, OK, I mention Leningrad : 1 million civilians killed ONLY in Leningrad...
Are the german civilians more worth than the russians?

Rochus Misch the last living survivor in the bunker has stated the movie was "hollywood drama" & was more of a glamorization then an authentic depiction of the final bunker days in 1945-that being said-- remember-- Stalin made a huge deal with Hitler in 1939 & England & France allowed Germany to regain lost lands--Hitler was not alone in the actions of history--as far as holacausts go-- if you have ever resided in the USA you hear about it so much you think it happened in 2002 in Virginia-its saturated in the media there-- when in reality-- over 30 million babys have been killed in abortions in the USA since 1973--remember-- until Germany reunited--aboriton was banned in the former Reich-why?? it was deemed as murder-- & Germans know what the loss of Christianity led to-- lots of deaths-- it seems the world never learns--nothing happens in history without a reason--there are always 2 sides to every story-- right ot wrong-- I may some day see this movie-- but not with hollywood type eyes but with objective research--peace to all

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